LISTSERV mailing list manager LISTSERV 16.0

Help for TEAM-ADA Archives


TEAM-ADA Archives

TEAM-ADA Archives


TEAM-ADA@LISTSERV.ACM.ORG


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

TEAM-ADA Home

TEAM-ADA Home

TEAM-ADA  November 1996

TEAM-ADA November 1996

Subject:

Re: hw/sw Co-Design Language (CDL)

From:

Brad Balfour <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Brad Balfour <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 13 Nov 1996 11:36:13 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (71 lines)

At 4:59 AM -0500 11/13/96, Ken Garlington wrote:
[snip]
>I was actually planning on trying (on my own time) to create an Ada subset
>using GNAT, that would be applicable to 8-bit and 16-bit microcontroller
>software. Right now, we have to ask for waivers for a lot of these
>applications. If someone has already done some work on defining such a
>subset, I'd like to know how it was derived. Certainly, if we don't come up
>with a version of Ada that doesn't require much (if any RAM), we'll never
>get past using C and assembly for these tiny processors, which seem to pop up
>in all sorts of applications.

[snip again]
>I actually don't see the problem with building a "tiny Ada" or CDL compiler
>under the current rules. You can certainly pass validation using a subset of
>tests, if you can show that the other tests are inappropriate for a given
>target. I would think a target with 256 bytes of RAM, for example, would be
>reasonable grounds for not supporting heap management, etc. However, without
>someone having a compelling reason to try to build such a product, we'll
>never know for sure. The developers of such systems won't use Ada because (a)
>they are usually writing less than 4K of source code. so the advantages of
>Ada are less obvious, and (b) there's no compilers. Compiler vendor's won't
>build compilers because the users aren't begging them to build something.

Sy Wong wrote:
>> To: Jim Moore, ACM Techn. Stds Comm. Chair <[log in to unmask]> 1996.11.2
[snip]
>> Logic do not prevail for a
>> vendor that only caters to the SSS market to develope a compiler for full
>> Ada-95 solely to get validation and then make sure that the customer
>> cannot use the restricted constructs.  The other two listed application
>> areas have similar requirements for the SSS sector where Annex-H
>> restricted compiler can have a market.  In particular, in the EDA market,
>> this subset can serve both as Hardware Design/Description Language (HDL)
>> in addition to programming and can be used as hw/sw Co-Design Language
>> (CDL).

There is a theme running through the above three paragraphs from Ken & Sy
that I don't understand. Both of you seem to be under the impression that
it is important for a compiler targeted at the "commercial 8-bit
microcontroller" market to implement the full Ada language, to be
validated, and then to enforce restrictions on using many features (via
Annex H).

It would seem to me to be much simpler to just:
a) have the compiler process only those features that you want, and
b) ignore formal validation of the compiler

No one else in the commercial marketplace (e.g., automobiles, washing
machines,etc.) worries about whether the compiler for their langauge
(assembly or C) is validated. Why should they care if their Ada compiler is
or not?

If you, the maker of the compiler, want to ensure it's correctness, then
all  obtain a copy of the ACVC, delete those test that don't make sense for
your (subset) compiler, and run the test suite. You can even provide these
results to your customer upon request.

As long as we are not talking about the US DoD -- and we are not -- then
validation is not a requirement at all. Let's not let this impede our
progress into new commercial domains.

Brad


--
Brad Balfour                            SIGAda WWW Server
CACI, Inc.                                http://www.acm.org/sigada/
(703) 277-6767                          and also try:
[log in to unmask]                     http://www.adahome.com/
address: 3930 Pender Drive * Fairfax, VA 22030

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

Advanced Options


Options

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password


Search Archives

Search Archives


Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe


Archives

December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
June 2007
May 2007
March 2007
February 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003
December 2002
November 2002
October 2002
September 2002
August 2002
July 2002
June 2002
May 2002
April 2002
March 2002
February 2002
December 2001
November 2001
October 2001
September 2001
August 2001
July 2001
June 2001
May 2001
April 2001
March 2001
February 2001
January 2001
December 2000
November 2000
October 2000
September 2000
August 2000
July 2000
June 2000
May 2000
April 2000
March 2000
February 2000
January 2000
December 1999
November 1999
October 1999
September 1999
August 1999
July 1999
June 1999
May 1999
April 1999
March 1999
February 1999
January 1999
December 1998
November 1998
October 1998
September 1998
August 1998
July 1998
June 1998
May 1998
April 1998
March 1998
February 1998
January 1998
December 1997
November 1997
October 1997
September 1997
August 1997
July 1997
June 1997
May 1997
April 1997
March 1997
February 1997
January 1997
December 1996
November 1996
October 1996

ATOM RSS1 RSS2



LISTSERV.ACM.ORG

Secured by F-Secure Anti-Virus CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager