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"Team Ada: Ada Advocacy Issues (83 & 95)" <[log in to unmask]>
"Brashear, Phil" <[log in to unmask]>
Wed, 6 Jun 2001 18:15:42 -0500
John McCormick <[log in to unmask]>
John McCormick <[log in to unmask]>
<[log in to unmask]>
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The Dale C++ book is a rework of my Ada version.


At 04:00 PM 06/06/2001 -0400, Brashear, Phil wrote:
>For CS2:
>Main and Savitch, Data Structures and Other Objects Using C++ (Addison
>Dale, C++ Plus Data Structures (Jones and Bartlett)
>They're out there!
>We're using Dale at the University of Dayton (where I teach part time).
>Philip W. Brashear
>Software Quality Assurance
>EDS Corporation
>[log in to unmask]
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Jack Beidler [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
>Sent: Wednesday, June 06, 2001 3:17 PM
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: generics in Java
>Regarding Terry Westley wrote:
> > Some people should read the literature for design of other languages.
> > Or, perhaps they just need to escape the NIH (not invented here)
> >
> > >From <,4586,2769630,00.html>
> >
> >         Generics is controversial and has been widely debated inside and
>outside of Sun.
> >         Gosling said the concept is so complicated that no two developers
>could agree on
> >         exactly how it should be implemented. He and Sun Chief Scientist
>Bill Joy "got as
> >         close to physical violence as we've gotten," he said, because Joy
>wanted to slip
> >         Java for two or three years until Sun figured out generics.
>However, developers
> >         converged on an answer about two years ago, and then Sun waited
>while the issue
> >         wended its way through the Java Community Process. Gosling said
>reliability is
> >         critical to Java because it raises developer productivity,
>allowing them to
> >         "spend less of their lives fixing broken applications."
> >
> > --
> > Terry Westley
> > [log in to unmask]
>It is a shame that the idiots in charge of Java don't have enough brains to
>look at the
>generic/template models of Ada and C++.  I am currently working on a couple
>of papers with
>two of my colleagues on Java's lack of template/generic capabilities. One of
>my colleagues is
>a C++ guy and we have been comparing Ada generics and C++ templates with an
>eye towards how
>we might like to see a generic/template feature implemented in Java.
>The issue is much deeper than that.  How many students go through an
>undergraduate program
>with any real software reuse experience (I can see it now, I am about to get
>flamed).  People
>seem to claim as software reuse experience by just throwing any crap they
>want into a library
>and presto they are doing reuse.
>Granted, there are some pretty good libraries out there in C++ and Java, but
>I just did a
>survey of CS 2 and CS 7 (Advanced data structures and algorithms) texts
>using C++.  Would you
>believe that I could not find one book that uses C++ templates to
>encapsulate the basic data
>structures?  If one of you know one, let me know.
>Now keep in mind that just about all the Java book for these courses are
>"global replaces" of
>the various author's C++ books and you can see that we are facing a
>generation of programmers
>who have been raised on C++ and Java and have no real clue as to how to use
>generic/template for the construction of reusable software!
>If the software industry is in trouble now, I have a pretty good clue where
>it is going to be
>in the future as more and more schools dumb down there CS programs.
>Jack Beidler
>John (Jack) Beidler, Ph.D., Professor of Computer Science
>Computing Sciences Department
>University of Scranton
>Scranton, PA 18510
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