My wife teaches mostly C++ over at a major community college outside of DC. (No it isn't quite as bad as Carville/Matalin at home although this morning there was a discussion of "our individual opinions" wrt readability of C++ :--) ) Anyway, apparently there has been a switch recently from Pascal to C++ for the intro class. The intro C++ is being taught without the object oriented aspects of the language, so I guess it really becomes a "C class using the non-object oriented constructs specific to C++ and not in C, and using a C++ compiler", from what I can tell. The professors there are very concerned because their students are performing much more poorly than they did with Pascal as an intro language. Now factoring out issues such as "teaching C++ for the first time" (which maybe is more important in all of this than the language) ..... well what are your all thoughts on this. Joe